The Big Blog

ljguitar commented Friday, Apr 1

Yeah - but while you are at it will you make it look and feel like a Mac program instead of Windoze? Please…

alexrodriguez commented Friday, Apr 1

The new interface is horrible, frankly its down to where I only login if I know someone needs me otherwise I don't run the app.

Looking forward to seeing what solution you can come up with.

kirichkov commented Friday, Apr 1

How about you consider creating a version 2.9 of Skype that features exactly the same interface as 2.8 but also enables group video?

selfpartwo commented Friday, Apr 1

Why don't you just commit to supporting 2.8 indefinitely? Most of us would be happy if you did.

I have no complaints with 2.8. I'm not sure why you felt it needed such a drastic overhaul. I can multi task, phone, IM and video just fine. So can my 70 year father and 90 year Grandma. Seriously. They tried Skype 5 and I had to revert it back for them. There is just too much going on there for it to be at all user friendly.

2.8 is fine. Don't add anymore features to it. A lot of us just use iChat for screen sharing and group video anyways, and I won't pay for group video, thats ridiculous.

erykroderyk commented Friday, Apr 1

The whole ICQ/old Skype/Adium/iChat/Jabber/Google chat paradigm—a tight floating contact list + floating (tabbed or separated at will) chat windows—did not ever need to be broken or improved. It was good, it was what Skype was about.

People devise a small portion of their screen for the contact list to be always visible, then add or close chat windows. That's all there is to it.

Roll back to that (2.8) visual style and you will get no less than 80% of users happy.

2.8 did have its problems, like i.e. lack of new message notification in dock icon during conversation (bumping the icon doesn't count, you need to add number of unread messages like all good software does). This is something you might want to deal with.

Anyway, good to finally see you acknowledge user feedback. When you first published the 5 beta, you removed my negative comment from your blog.
See what Twitter is doing, they just removed quickbar (#dickbar) from iPhone client and rolled back to a clean, "old" version.

There's probably a million people who would be thankful if you did just that.

philippmirow commented Friday, Apr 1

oh look its april fools. is it just me or does that basically read we've read your comments and are going to just go ahead and ignore them. If you want the old skype here's the link but dont expect it to be updated.
I guess Rick has also made it quite clear that the combined window is staying for good, so much for hoping that'll change! Note how skype only cares about less frequent and new users -- time to look for a replacement!

bchmrk commented Friday, Apr 1

I dislike the new UI but why not a choice of interfaces as I like the appreciate performance enhancements.

For more than ten years I am using (paid) Skype (still can remember the first time I noticed 1million users at one time) and am happy with the way it is. Group video calling and such are a waste for me at this stage.

Please consult a user group before making these major UI changes as you can loose us easy to new market entrants.

chuck.burt commented Friday, Apr 1

I won't mind the "one window" layout if you make some enhancements to the Contact Monitor HUD as follows:
1. Don't make it a HUD. Having the option to have it always on top might be nice, but it's intrusive.
2. Allow us to select multiple contacts in order to initiate a conference chat/call/etc.
3. Allow us to drag files to it.
4. Allow us to specify the order of groups within it.

So basically, make the Contact Monitor exactly like the old buddy list.

theredguy25 commented Saturday, Apr 2

I want to add this in and hopefully it makes a bit of sense:

The chat box underneath a call, especially on MacBook and MacBook Pro models, doesn't normally allow the user to view too much of the chat unless the top area (normally containing video, but if video off it's an icon) is dragged up.

However, I've noticed quite a big of useless space between lines of text sent and an even larger gap between the last message sent and the input box.

I understand trying to make the chat more readable, but optimal readability can still be attained while dropping a few pixels here and there—especially the 20 or 30 between the last message sent and the input box.

john.the.blind commented Saturday, Apr 2

Thank you, Skype for Mac team. I am glad to hear this. i was seriously considering seeking an alternative, but this post has changed my mind. I hope in the next few iterations that issues with video quality for those of us with third-party HD webcams on the Mac (mini) will be resolved so I can take advantage of the 'HD' part. Also, I am wondering if an HD audio codec is going to be implemented on Skype for Mac. Thank you again. Keep up the good work.

engyew commented Saturday, Apr 2

Thank you! Thank you! Thank you! For listening to your Mac users!

brycehug commented Saturday, Apr 2

Dear Skype,

Please quit trying to "interpret" what we are telling you as you are failing at that too. The Skype 5 UI for Mac doesn't just fall short in some aspects. It's a complete train wreck! We want the Skype 2.8 UI back in Skype 6. No interpretation necessary and no excuses.

Not only do advanced users find the new UI difficult and frustrating to use but novice and new users hate equally as much. Everyone I know who has come into contact with Skype 5 (including grandparents, parents, teens, and children) has commented on how frustrating and annoying the software is. This includes mothers and students in China (No Chinese grandmothers were available for comment).

Please note that while I understand mistakes do happen, as a paying subscriber I will not hesitate to take my business and that of my family and friends elsewhere should you continue in the current direction.

PS: Why did it take you so long to repost v2.8? Your own user support team has been left covering for you by handing out links to mac.oldapps.com for months.

jimexplainsitall commented Saturday, Apr 2

A good start to alleviate my frustration would be to stop floating the contact monitor above all other windows. i currently have it pushed to the lower right corner and mostly off the screen, and yet it still gets in the way. Command 3 is nice, but consider this: command 3 only works if you are actively using Skype. if it's running in the background, command 3 is useless. At least allow me the option to decide if I want to devote a large portion of my screen real estate to Skype, or to the application I choose. You guys work on skype all day long, so of course it's the foremost app on your screen. When i am working on a project, but waiting for a call, I want to work on that project, and worry about Skype when the call comes in, but not before.

popnchocky commented Saturday, Apr 2

"Nevertheless, we believe that the 5.X platform offers significant advantages over the previous versions for the majority of our users, and this is borne out in the usage and opinion data we’re seeing from the Mac user base as a whole."

Can you share the source of this information with us ?
It's the opposite of what I see at work. I don't know a single user that stuck with 5.x.

peterparkes commented Saturday, Apr 2

Thanks for the comments so far – for those of you advocating a complete return to the 2.8 UI, I have a question: do you think we’ve accurately captured your frustration with the 5.X UI with the two statements in the blog post? Or is there something else you think we should look at?

bredelet commented Saturday, Apr 2

Thank you for making the latest version of 2.8 available for download. Installed now.

Let me know when you allow us to hide the sidebar. The window *is* too big.

nolankevin commented Saturday, Apr 2

This is a rather mealy mouthed response to an overwhelmingly negative response to 5.X.
The majority of people don't like the design choices you've made. In fact many of them were simply wrong. Please acknowledge that rather than telling us that we simply don't "get" it and you've designed the new interface for everyone.

Why not simply make the perfectly usable 2.8 interface available with the next version as an option with the various performance tweaks under the bonnet? I understand you spend a lot of time, and money, developing a new interface "experience" and you want to stand by that. But this smells of someone's personal project rather than sensible design.

Consider the recent UI update on the Steam platform before it was rolled out on OS X. Steam has always been small and tidy and sits in the corner of my Window's desktop all the time. (Just as Skype 2.8 does on my Mac) It can be expanded into the larger Steam Store/Community etc. In the beta they introduced a much larger chunky UI without the popular compact mode. Huge amounts of feedback petitioned for a return of the compact mode which was promptly delivered. Why? Because this compact mode is how 99% of users actually use Steam. In the same way people have certain expectations regarding IM clients. It's a utility, a small app that sits to one side and allows you to do things on the side. Steam lets me mange my games but doesn't get in my face other than to offer a list of games. Skype 2.8 offers a nice small list of contacts that I can interact with and if I need more focused usage I can open a larger window. When I'm done it goes back away into it's corner.

Even my own computer illiterate mother wanted to go back to 2.8 after she got lost in 5. If you think jumbo icons make things easy for older people or less tech savvy people, your mistaken. The debacle over Office 2010 testifies to that. I've found such folks typically have to learn everything as a procedure. If there is an update like the one from 2.8 to 5 they suddenly panic because they have to learn a new sequence of steps from scratch.

Such a drastic and unnecessary change is only going to piss off everyone. People "wot aren't good on computers" will find it disorientating and confusing while everyone else will be annoyed by the Fisher Price look.

_veiko_ commented Saturday, Apr 2

A short answer to Peter would be "no". People here are not talking about frequency of multitasking, they are talking about screen real estate usage. This comes at a real premium on laptops and Skype should not assume that its program is so invaluable as to take up screen space for unnecessary information and graphics. When users are having a video call, they want to be able to just display the video window. If users mainly use Skype for chats, they want to be able to hide all other parts of the program. Simple as that. I don't think anybody has a problem with the unified window mode for new users, but please, make it optional.

adrianlafond commented Saturday, Apr 2

I'm glad to see Skype is actually listening to it's users. But skype is still ignoring the main complaints. By multitasking within Skype, people mean being able to see, simultaneously, each chat, video, or call that is happening, if they want to, as well as all contacts; switching the mode of a single view is no substitute for this.

When people complain about the size, they mean literally that: it's too big in relation to other apps they also need to work with. What does Cmd 3 to view contacts have to do with it? That's important, but a completely different issue. Also, despite how much screen real estate the new window steals, there is so much less info shown: only about 1/3 the contacts as before.

I understand that skype has invested a huge amount of time and resources into 5.x, but the criticism from users in this and other forums has been consistent and concrete for some time now, and skype just appears stubborn in response. For example, in the blog post, scare quotes were place around 'size' and the writer, basically, just changed the subject. There is a lot of merit in what users are saying.

selfpartwo commented Saturday, Apr 2

I use Skype for business. I have about 4 or 5 contacts that I regularly need in my contact window for IM chat. For my calls I use the search bar to quickly gain access to one of my contacts. This is the easiest way. I don't want to have all my contacts in my face, nor do I want previous contacts, "this week" or floating contacts or whatever else.

I use video chats once or twice a week with my family overseas. 2.8 is simple for this. Every so often we open iChat for group video, but not enough that we would ever pay for the service on Skype.

This is how I use Skype. I understand other people might have 30 contacts that they might want to see at one time of whatever, but the fact is, its your job to design and accommodate both types of users.

Speaking of iChat. I can have a Skype 2.8 contact list, and an iChat contact list beside each other, and it still takes up less screen real estate than Skype 5. This is a problem for me. The amount of real estate Skype 5 takes up is the single biggest issue for me. I do not want the all in one window solution you are trying to push on users.

rrooley commented Saturday, Apr 2

I am still getting to terms with 5, generally welcome. using Skype a lot I do need an easy way of knowing my missed calls. in 2.8 they were clearly identified. Now I have to work to find them. today calls with a red symbol would help as before

elaine.l.smith commented Saturday, Apr 2

Skype, please, please take note: with this new Mac version, what you have done is the same as what Tropicana Juice did when they tried to overhaul their product packaging - they made everyone very unhappy, but they learned, and switched back straight away to the old design. They got a ton of POSITIVE publicity as a result.

I have no idea why you have changed a great app into something barely usable which looks like it was designed to run on Windows XP. It's TERRIBLE. Please just change it back and keep your Mac fans on your side!

I just want to see my Skype video contacts first, and those with phone numbers underneath, as before. I can also cope with a lot of info on the screen at once, and so can a Chinese grandmother, please don't be so patronising, who are you, Microsoft?

We have already reverted back to the old version (2.8.0.866) so we have all our Skype video contacts together and can see which ones are online.

nan.wang-de commented Saturday, Apr 2

The new UI is a disaster mainly because the giant buttons. I am using skype as a chatting tool not a web browser that takes up almost all my screen. At least offer people some choice to modify the layout. The coverflow is useless also. So I am going back to 2.8 without hesitation until they fix this problem. For the new UI designer, YOU SUCK!!!

syklist_stan commented Saturday, Apr 2

I think you are missing the point that the single combined window IS the issue for MacOSX users. If you want Skype for Mac users to use your premium video conferencing services, en masse, then you are going to have to modify v2.8 to support video conferencing.

As it stands, Skype 5 for mac is the best advert for Gtalk I have ever seen.

rickyegeland commented Saturday, Apr 2

I'm downloading Skype 2.8 as I type. Good riddance to version 5.x!

Besides the UI being a step backwards from the manageable little window we had before, I have noticed more problems with dropped calls, failed connections, and poor audio quality, and outright crashes than I had when I was using 2.8.

The UI problems are serious and go beyond the "advanced multitasking user" points you make in this post. The first thing I noticed on day one of using Skype 5.0 is that I can't look far back in my history any more. Where are my old calls? I used to use that information. The contacts list is a mess. This program isn't Photoshop - you shouldn't need or want to take up such a portion of the screen.

I hope version 2.8 will remain supported until Skype can take the reaction of version 5.0 seriously and learn from this mistake. If that doesn't happen, don't expect to see any more Skype Credits purchased from my account.

brycehug commented Sunday, Apr 3

Hello Peterparkes,

I don't think you have accurately captured my frustration or those of my family or friends at all. Your own post is an excellent example of this. You are clearly aware that most of us want, as you put it "A complete return to the 2.8 UI", yet the original post states "we will be sticking with the metaphor of a primary, combined window".

We want a minimalistic slimmed down multi window UI similar or identical in design to v2.8 or Adium. Its that simple.

PS: Im sure most of the Mac users at Skype feel the same way as the rest of us.

psxtreme commented Sunday, Apr 3

I gotta say I'm glad you are continuing to support the old version. I really can't stand the new one and have used it less and less due to the horrible interface. What exactly were you guys smoking when you came up with that GUI anyway?

ferrouswheel commented Monday, Apr 4

Just to counter all the negativity. I love the new interface... especially the hiding of contacts that I rarely ever talk to. So much simpler. Take heart though - people always get precious when you change an interface people have grown accustomed to.

I think 2.8 had bad usability. I always searching for the right button to push, but now things are where I'd expect them to be intuitively.

So thank you - and don't let the complainers get you down. Innovate fearlessly.

notgeorge commented Monday, Apr 4

@Peterparkes

No, I don't think that you've captured our frustration with the statements in the blog post.

Like many above, I interpret it as bull-headed developers / designers who have sold themselves on the coolness of their design and are currently incapable of a) recognizing that they've made a mistake and b) attempting to recover. Step one is to identify that you have a problem - you're still in the pathetic denial and limp attempts at pacification phase.

At its most basic, I believe that you have confused "design" with "usability."

For example - at no point in the statements above do you say anything about screen real-estate. I use skype every day from a laptop......with a laptop screen......not a particularly large laptop screen. With the new design I have to keep the program maximized to be able to see anything more than 15 lines of chat log. The increase in spacing between chat lines and the thick user bar at the top make it difficult to glance through the chat logs of the multiple skype chat rooms I'm currently in and I'm incapable of viewing an active skype chat on one side of the screen and a terminal / text editor / etc. on the other side.

Your "design" is getting in the way of my ability to actually "use" the program.

I don't know how you justified these and similar decisions in your mind, but the "more like a mac" cop-out is pretty weak. Apple came out with a revolutionary phone that has one button and nobody freaked out - they loved it. You came out with an update to your layout and had to close comments in the announcement post because you were getting blown out of the water by how much people hated it.

It's quite clear that you folks are no Steve Jobs and the sooner you embrace that fact and stop trying to tell your users what's good for them, the sooner you'll be able to put up blog posts without cringing.

Ah, my downgrade to 2.8 has finished, now I can get back to work.

mxpal1 commented Monday, Apr 4

@peterparkes: The problem with the contact monitor, is that it is always on top. The problem with the combined window is that it is just too big.

The old two window system meant that I could hide the contact list behind another window while having the chat window open, or vice versa. Both windows were significantly smaller than the combined window.

flash5standingby commented Monday, Apr 4

What is even more repugnant is that you forced the upgrade thru, ignoring my preference to skip it.

While the reinstatement of 2.8 is much welcomed, thank you, my treatment in this case has lead to a serious erosion of trust.

dmjossel commented Monday, Apr 4

In response to "do you think we’ve accurately captured your frustration with the 5.X UI with the two statements in the blog post?" I'd say, no, not exactly.

There's a distinct spin you need to apply to interpret the near-universal comment "the interface takes up too much space" to a desire to do more "multitasking", either inside or outside of Skype.

Most of the time what Skype or any IM or communications app is doing is idling, providing updates on user presence. It should do this while consuming a minimum of system resources-- screen real estate included. It should stay as far out of your way as possible until the user indicates that interaction is desired. Already, Skype 2.8 is not as good at this as many other apps on the Mac: Adium for IM and, incredibly, FaceTime for VOIP, which essentially has no UI whatsoever until a call is initiated.

Even so, 2.8 can be tweaked to provide a minimal, online contacts list with updated presence information that doesn't obscure too much of the screen to allow other apps to be used. It is disingenuous to describe this as "multitasking with other apps". It's a skype-centric viewpoint to call it that. This isn't "I want to do other things while I have Skype open"-- the idea is that while I am actively engaged in using my computer for other things, it is to some degree useful to have Skype open should I need it. With Skype 5, the app became a positive hindrance to doing anything OTHER than using Skype-- to the point that it encourages using the machine solely for Skype while it is open, and then closing Skype when finished, or at least, hiding all of its windows. The contact pane takes up too much space even to keep that open-- even the revised one.

peterparkes commented Monday, Apr 4

Thanks again for the follow-up comments. To address a few of the questions raised:

We realise that it’s frustrating to be told the new design works when (in its current form) it doesn’t work for you. That’s why we’re committed to making changes to address your feedback.

On the ‘screen real estate’ point – we hear that loud and clear. But we think heart of the problem is actually about multitasking rather than window size. The reason you ask for a smaller window is because you want to see your Skype contacts (or a video call) while doing something else.

And some specific replies:

@adrianlafond – to your multitasking point, that’s exactly how we interpret it too, so apologies if that wasn’t clear in the post. We plan to make changes to allow you to see multiple modes at once.

@rickyegeland – your full history is still there – just click a contact, and use the ‘View Earlier Messages’ bar across the top to navigate back through the history. You can also type in the search box to search through your IM history.

@notgeorge – we launched a chat style competition a couple of weeks ago, and I expect that the results will include some more compact designs.

@rrooley @mxpal1 – thanks for the specific feedback; we’ll be sure to note it.

@flash5standingby – 2.8–5.X wasn’t a forced upgrade; you should have been given the choice. If not, and you can repeat the problem, please let us know!

paulvachier commented Tuesday, Apr 5

thanks for the udpate!

sgerstenberger commented Tuesday, Apr 5

I'm glad there seems to be a dialog here. Otherwise I wouldn't bother to comment.

I'm pretty sure there are a good number of us who don't spend a lot of time using Skype yet do use it regularly, say once or twice a week. (Wouldn't this include the vast majority of your new users?)

So, I have no interest in having a Skype presence of any size visible and taking up screen space (or other machine resources). I thought that 2.8 was pretty unintrusive, but 5 is there in my face. Maybe I just haven't figured out how to use it , but for now my solution is command-Q. I'm going to switch back to 2.8 and try 5 again sometime in the indefinite future (having held onto the 2.8 install image).

alexandre_takacs commented Tuesday, Apr 5

Thanks for making 2.8 available again - this is definitely a good step towards restoring some sanity in the user experience on Mac.
As for 5.x it's nothing short of an abomination. The only reasonable answer would be to rewrite the UI from scratch into something decent. An please, please fire your UI designer - he is a deranged man !

bencowie commented Tuesday, Apr 5

@peterparkes no, Skype is not capturing the idea of why 5.x is bad. Single window design is a failure for most Mac apps, multi-window is essential to my continued use of Skype. Screen real estate is an issue - twice the space for half the contacts doesn't work, it's been said a million times before, look at Adium for an example. Being able to organize video/chat boxes on their own, around whatever else I'm doing is an issue. Bringing a PC app to the Mac is an issue. Skype 2.8 was such a good UI, I can't believe there was even talk of going away from it. Whoever made that decision should clearly not work at Skype anymore.

jonathanblaine commented Wednesday, Apr 6

5 is a complete failure. Windows users, perhaps, need simplicity (and solitaire). Mac users want usability and productivity. I'm sorry, but the thing taking up 2/3 of my Macbook Pro screen won't cut it.

I've reverted to 2.8. Small amount of desktop real estate. Everything at once glance without scrolling. Moving stuff to my screen where I want it, and hiding stuff I don't want to see.

Please hire some real Mac programmers and software design specialists.

brycehug commented Wednesday, Apr 6

Dear peterparkes

In response to your statement "we hear that loud and clear. But we think heart of the problem is ...":

If you didn't wan't to hear our answer then why did you bother asking?!

brycehug commented Wednesday, Apr 6

Dear peterparkes

In response to your statement "we hear that loud and clear. But we think heart of the problem is ...":

If you didn't want to hear our answer then why did you bother asking?!

leah.s.taylor commented Wednesday, Apr 6

Am I the only one who had major problems with the actual functionality of making calls, video or just audio? With Skype 5, when I would receive a call it would continue to ring for about 15 seconds AFTER I answered, and the same would happen when I would make a call - it would keep ringing well after the person responded. Also, video became an impossibility. I have the highest speed internet you can have and suddenly my video became consistently choppy. I have NEVER had either of these problems with 2.8, and I can't tell you how happy I am to have it back.

dreamingwell commented Wednesday, Apr 6

Here's a very simple idea, that you could probably implement in less than a day that would make Skype easier for everyone (stupid and smart people a like).

Make an option for the Monitor List (Online Contacts List) to not always be on-top. A single small list of people exactly what most of the people here want. However, making it always on top of other windows is infuriating. Just a list of online contacts. That's it. Simple.

(See every other IM client ever made for reference)

dreamingwell commented Wednesday, Apr 6

... and a comment about your concern for "grandmothers in China". I'm going to out on a limb here and say you need to satisfy the people that are actually giving you feedback. If that includes "grandmother's in China", then they should be included. But telling a bunch of people that actually take the time to provide feedback that you consider those that arn't giving feed back just as important is insulting.

We're here. We're talking to you. We are proving that we care enough to participate. It's most probable that we're your core customers. Satisfy your core customers, and they'll do more than your company could ever do for product evangelism.

dreamingwell commented Wednesday, Apr 6

... and finally... about the following quote

"We take a huge number of factors into consideration when designing software: from different usage patterns (video/voice/IM) to technical literacy; from age to cultural norms. All of these have an impact on everything from product and process design, user interface layout, iconography and more"

No you don't. You might have a guy that thinks he's the end-all-be-all of UX. You might even have a team of people that think they're the great wizards of coming up with a design that's "fresh, new, exciting, focused', blah blah blah.

If you do, they need to be fired.

There's ZERO you've done in this UI that any-joe-off-the-street couldn't have surmised with a 10 minutes and a scratch pad. You've not made a new UI elements that don't exist in a thousand other applications. You've not arranged them in a way that makes simple use easier. There's not a single thing in this UI that wasn't avaible in most applications in 2001.

The only thing you've done here is take very standard elements (lists, chat windows, buttons) and arranged them in a specific and fixed way. There's a reason EVERY OTHER IM CLIENT USES MULTIPLE WINDOWS. Because it's tested, tried and true. If you think your team is "innovative" or "considerate" because they tied a chat window to a left hand side list, you're delusional.

max.rydahl.andersen commented Wednesday, Apr 6

"On the ‘screen real estate’ point – we hear that loud and clear. But we think heart of the problem is actually about multitasking rather than window size. The reason you ask for a smaller window is because you want to see your Skype contacts (or a video call) while doing something else."

No, I do not need to see all my contacts while i'm doing other things.

I want to easily show the contact list when doing other things, but it does not need to be on the screen at the same time - with 200+ contacts it does not really have a purpose on my screen.

What I want is that I can decide where on my screen I want the various chat/call windows - and they might be on different areas of the screen or on even different monitors.

That can't really be fixed without supporting multiple windows as an option.

And btw. Cmd+3 mentioned in the original post is rather useless since you have to use the mouse to browse through all your contacts instead of just typing their name.

sinisterandroid commented Thursday, Apr 7

Yep. Rolling back.

You know what? I actually *like* the new chat style. For the most part. The visual design of 5.0 is pretty good – god knows that 2.8 needed some love in that regard – it's the new UI that I can't stand.

For all the problems with it, lack of separate windows, confusing-as-hell-sidebar, etc... The dealbreaker is the loss of the history. My old history *isn't* still there – I've looked. I use Skype for two things, mainly – as my "home phone" and for work conference calls / chats. Guess what. Group chats sure as hell aren't listed. Messing around with it now, looks like I can bring up those chats by searching for them by name, but is that really the only way?

And not everyone who calls me is in my contact list. Sometimes these numbers even leave me voice mail. I've tried and tried to find those in 5.0 to no avail. I even tried searching for the phone number, thinking that maybe they worked like group chat. Can't find'em. Can't find any of my voicemail.

So yeah, I'm rolling back. From the sound of it, I won't be upgrading anytime soon, either.

sinisterandroid commented Thursday, Apr 7

Yep. Rolling back.

You know what? I actually *like* the new chat style. For the most part. The visual design of 5.0 is pretty good – god knows that 2.8 needed some love in that regard – it's the new UI that I can't stand.

For all the problems with it, lack of separate windows, confusing-as-hell-sidebar, etc... The dealbreaker is the loss of the history. My old history *isn't* still there – I've looked. I use Skype for two things, mainly – as my "home phone" and for work conference calls / chats. Guess what. Group chats sure as hell aren't listed. Messing around with it now, looks like I can bring up those chats by searching for them by name, but is that really the only way?

And not everyone who calls me is in my contact list. Sometimes these numbers even leave me voice mail. I've tried and tried to find those in 5.0 to no avail. I even tried searching for the phone number, thinking that maybe they worked like group chat. Can't find'em. Can't find any of my voicemail.

So yeah, I'm rolling back. From the sound of it, I won't be upgrading anytime soon, either.

j.t.musson commented Thursday, Apr 7

Peter and Rick, thank you for looking at this, and acknowledging that there's dissatisfaction out there.

But going down the line of "you're plainly saying x, but we think you really mean y" seems like an odd way to do customer service.

I think it's actually multitasking *within* Skype that's the issue. Skype 5 is basically one big modal window. Of course it's not, because it's still possible to chat while calling, but it doesn't feel that way at all. When you're in a call, it feels like navigating away will end the call. It doesn't, but that's how it seems. Again, when I'm in a chat: will navigating away close that chat?

Modality works for something like iTunes, mostly, because it's usually for one main thing: playing music. But Skype, like every other chat app, lends itself to non-modal layouts because you would expect to be able to do more than one thing at once, like talking to Grandma while chatting to a couple of friends. These are separate, discrete tasks. So they can't all happen in the same giant window. This was what worked for me about 2.8. I could have a video call in one window, while having all chats in another (though it would have been better still to have a window with tabbed chat).

Please consider that your users have something to say here about how the giant, universal window doesn't fly.

mikkoj commented Thursday, Apr 7

Thanks for listening to the feedback. Unfortunately, I am stuck with 5.0 because we use group video at work. I am actively exploring other options to suggest to the company, though. It pains me that I've been a long time paying customer, and you release sub-standard designs. There was an auto-charge for a Skype subscription again, and I just felt angry. I closed the automatic renewals now.

Nobody here has yet pointed out the main problem with 5.0. It is ugly. The bulky window wastes so much space it feels far from a native Mac app. The chrome in the top bar is huge and completely unused. The contact list is bloated and grabs too much space and cannot be condensed. The group video chat window (yes that feature>) is a leviathan. Where should I put my own window, that single floating thing? I move it around the calls all the time.

Then of course, usability. Poor access to chat history is just an unbelievable screw up. Accessing chat history feels like a hack every time, opening that huge list of messages from the last months or weeks. Did you test this with real users? I think the problem hasn't been so much the UI people, but the user testing. Please fix that.

We do want you to progress and innovate. We don't want 2.8, though it was better. We want better things. We just want them done properly, according to what we need, not what you think we might need and force upon us.

mikkoj commented Thursday, Apr 7

Thanks for listening to the feedback. Unfortunately, I am stuck with 5.0 because we use group video at work. I am actively exploring other options to suggest to the company, though. It pains me that I've been a long time paying customer, and you release sub-standard designs. There was an auto-charge for a Skype subscription again, and I just felt angry. I closed the automatic renewals now.

Nobody here has yet pointed out the main problem with 5.0. It is ugly. The bulky window wastes so much space it feels far from a native Mac app. The chrome in the top bar is huge and completely unused. The contact list is bloated and grabs too much space and cannot be condensed. The group video chat window (yes that feature>) is a leviathan. Where should I put my own window, that single floating thing? I move it around the calls all the time.

Then of course, usability. Poor access to chat history is just an unbelievable screw up. Accessing chat history feels like a hack every time, opening that huge list of messages from the last months or weeks. Did you test this with real users? I think the problem hasn't been so much the UI people, but the user testing. Please fix that.

We do want you to progress and innovate. We don't want 2.8, though it was better. We want better things. We just want them done properly, according to what we need, not what you think we might need and force upon us.

luisrosenthal commented Friday, Apr 8

I'm the only one in my company who doesn't complain about skype interface. That's because I downgraded back to 2.8!

Good luck with the next iteration though. I'm sure it'll be great.

meadedavid commented Friday, Apr 8

------ Quote ------
Some of you want to be able to multitask more between Skype and other apps
This is how we interpret feedback about the overall ‘size’ of Skype.
{-snip-}
We introduced the contact monitor panel in 5.X, which gives you an easy way to see your contacts’ status while you’re doing other things.
{-snip-}
we will be sticking with the metaphor of a primary, combined window which newer users and less frequent users find easier to learn. We plan to introduce overlay panels like the contact monitor to provide additional flexibility for those of you who need it.
------ /Quote ------

So, you don't have any plans to actually make any changes for this particular concern? You're just going to "stick with it", and if we don't like it we can keep using 2.8 forever? So ... We have what you've already given us in 5.X (and which we unanimously hate) -- but never fear, you're going to give us more things like it? What?!

Beyond 'overlay panels' being a half-reasoned non-answer, the Contact Monitor Panel does NOT function as a buddy list. It has no right-click options for the contacts listed, it doesn't allow you to show offline contacts. It's nearly useless except as a floating "click here to open the UI everyone seems to hate" button.

Beyond that, what about the issue that this primary window makes AWEFUL assumptions as to what information is important to me, and finds absurdly redundant ways to eat up my screen showing it (over and over again)? It's not just "make is smaller", its "let me tell you, what I want to see and how".

------ Quote ------
Some background: at Skype, we build products for users ranging from grandmothers in China to 15 year old students in Connecticut – and everyone else in between. We take a huge number of factors into consideration when designing software:
------ /Quote ------

And if a "show simple buddy list view" option didn't come out of those considerations, then such considerations were not actually focused on or considering actual 'business users' and the UX THEY wanted/needed, so much as those consideration were simply evaluating the UX YOU wanted to create for them.

All of this would just go away if you'd only give us a "just show me a buddy list view" option. It doesn't even have to be the default option. It can be buried in the preferences. But it has to be there.

------
erykroderyk commented:

The whole ICQ/old Skype/Adium/iChat/Jabber/Google chat paradigm—a tight floating contact list + floating (tabbed or separated at will) chat windows—did not ever need to be broken or improved. It was good, it was what Skype was about.
------

Exactly that. There's a reason every presence/communication tool out there has a similar UI/UX. It works. It's not fundamentally broken. It allows people to use the tool in the ways they want to use it. You can improve on this design, but throwing it out entirely just to be different is beyond needless ... it's a bad idea.

meadedavid commented Friday, Apr 8

------ Quote ------
we will be sticking with the metaphor of a primary, combined window which newer users and less frequent users find easier to learn. We plan to introduce overlay panels like the contact monitor to provide additional flexibility for those of you who need it.
------ /Quote ------

Also, do you know how insulting it is as a "long standing" and "frequent" user to hear that those users who are "newer" users and users likely to use the application "less frequently" are driving the destruction of basic usability for "loyal" "power users"?

I think you may have the 80/20 rule backwards in your head a little bit.

/sigh

renatebh commented Friday, Apr 8

Oh thank god I'm able to revert back to the old one.

I'm completely capable of working myself around a computer. But the new interface isn't at all intuitive. I opened an instant message conversation just to try it out, and now i can't get back to my contact list. When the skype icon had that little red number icon on it, i opened skype and couldn't even find out why the icon was red. I never had issues like these with the old interface.

Dear Skype-team,
I'm glad you focus on upgrading and making your program better, but this was wayy wayy too much for a user to handle. Like I said, the app needs to be intuitive, with the new interface it's far from it

skadood1 commented Saturday, Apr 9

I would like to present a detailed discussion to the post by Mr Rick Osterloh, VP Product Management & Design, and Mr Krishna Panicker, Product Manager of Skype for Mac. This was inspired by the invitation for discussion from Mr Peter Parkes, Social Media Communications Manager.

I think that many people complaining here are missing what the Skype employees are saying. Beginner and simple-use users are their focus. The majority of people effected are power-users, or moderate-users. What I think the Skype employees are beginning to respond to, is that you can serve both the beginner and power-user markets. To really do it right, I think full-app skinning is necessary.

After extensively researching what everyone is asking for, here and on other forums, and some of my own input, I want to summarize what I think are the missing needs that skype 5 does not provide to power-users. I will post the needs on the next comment (they are long). Many of these missing needs are why I and other power-users are staying on 2.8 for the time being.

-Nick Yeates-
Open Source Community Manager
Zenoss Inc.

skadood1 commented Saturday, Apr 9

Here is my compilation of missing needs in skype 5 (mac), for power-users.

1) Concise and powerful UI and UX
1a) Less whitespace
1b) Modularity of UI Elements - many seperate windows, if wanted - off by default?
1c) Contact listing - customizable, see below
1d) Smaller icons
1e) screensharing a selected portion of desktop

2) Contact Listing
Everyone does this differently. Consider introducing a hidden or hard to find ability that can turn on options, or allow skin-like customizability here. Deliver current default method so beginners continue to succeed.
2a) Fully functional while multitasking with other apps
2b) Grouping - by user group, online status, etc
2c) Ordering - by latest message, by last/first name, etc
2d) Alignment - Separate window, attached to chat window, left, right, top, bottom alignment
2e) Drag and drop files; windows always on top, or not
2f) All in one user listing - not separate listings for different uses - This will need to allow easily changing any of the above options to enable various use-cases and call/chat states

3) Customizability / reskin-ability of entire UI
This would theoretically solve everyones issues. You could fully deliver the default product as it looks now (as the default skin), and then allow the community to enable all other UIs that users want. Multiple windows, drag and dropping of elements within windows - all possible. In order to serve the beginner crowd, the default skin would remain the same, and the skinning option may be hard to get at.

4) Multitasking with other apps
4a) Fully functional CONCISE contact listing that works well with multitask - not a secondary one with less features. See 2f, all in one.
4b) Calls and Video that have extensive view options when multitasking - always on top, or not, sizing options, etc
4c) Can see multiple chats or videos while also operating 3rd party apps - multiple windows (modular UI) solves this, see above.

5) Multitasking within Skype
5a) Chat with 5 seperate conversations and see all without navigation
5b) Video and chatting and history all at the same time
5c) Send a file while doing any number of other things
5d) Basically, do any number of tasks within skype, all at the same time

cortizsc commented Saturday, Apr 9

Please, can you give as back the option from 2.8 to share a "screen selection"?

PLEASE

cortizsc commented Saturday, Apr 9

Hi,

I have a lot of contacts in my Address Book and some of them have multiple numbers, sometimes even 7 or 8 numbers.

In 2.8 contacts where not "integrated", they were just added to Skype as Address Book contacts, and all my numbers were there.

Now, in 5.X the contacts are "sort of integrated", but most of the time I have issues with numbers, as Skype only pulls some of them from my Address Book. Also, a lot of times I have duplicates, as Skype usernames normally don't match the real names.

I think the previous approach from 2.8 was better, although it needs to be enhanced. By the way, I don't really see the point in introducing a "Cover flow" in contacts. Most of my contacts don't have a picture, and if they do, it's obviously not a high resolution one, so the end result is very bad and useless.

Please take not of all our complaints, but consider, although we all know it's hard, enhancing the 2.8 version to match the functionality and look of Mac OS X Lion (you can find some inspiration in Facetime...), introducing video calls and forgetting about 5.X at all... it was clearly a failed attempt, a great mistake. I say this with all respect and consideration for your hard work, but I really believe the mac users deserve a Skype that has all the features 2.8 had, with the new Mac OS X look and functionality (full screen,...), also don't forget screen selection sharing,...

I think it would be very much appreciated by all users, even the ones you blame take advantage of this "new...look", like grandmothers in China. I have lived in China quite some time and I can tell you Chinese grandmothers prefer the features of 2.8 far more than the fancy/horrible look of the new UI.

Thank you for your response to our claims. But I think we deserve a real change, and not just a favorable interpretation of our hard criticism.

Best!

brakai295 commented Sunday, Apr 10

Unfortunately, I don't have the time to read through the entire comments section, so here just my 2 cents to the post:

You keep mentioning the point "multitasking". For me personally that is only a minor issue on the list of endless UI shortcomings. I just spent 3 minutes figuring out how I can delete a contact from my list - just to find that the 'delete' button on my keyboard is my only choice. This is a great example of how your UI and UX went from good to manageable to bad and confusing. It also took me ages to actually find my full contact list which didn't show up until I realised that a click on "Contacts" in the left hand side panel requires a second filtering-action on the top between "Family", "Skype" and "Adress Book". More confusing it could not be.

You mention that you are trying to address a broader audience and user-base. Well, with the latest version, all you do is confuse the heck out of existing users and make it really hard to get started for new users. I can't see one single UI improvement.

Focusing on better multitasking won't make any difference at all. What you need to do is to hire a UI expert to completely rethink the new interface. The design contest and making the old version available is a clear signal to us from you: "F*ck it, we give up! You figure it out somehow."

Very sad. Skype is such a good product.

peterjmit commented Monday, Apr 11

My initial reaction when opening v5 for the first time was why can't I make it smaller. There have been certain functions (that me as a very proficient computer user, and application designer) which have seemed masked unintuitive or downright unavailable. Even on a 24" monitor the window is very large, I haven't opened it on my 13" laptop scree yet

I feel sorry for less tech savvy users coming from 2.8.

Anyway 2.8 is now installed and I am happy again

cowsarescary commented Tuesday, Apr 12

Most poorly conceived and turgidly executed interface update I have ever seen.

So much basic functionality hidden or removed, and as for the interface size...

"But we think heart of the problem is actually about multitasking rather than window size. "

Have you even looked at it on a laptop designed for portable functionality? We don't all have massive screens, but apparently all your design and testing people do. The interface takes up half the screen but only manages to show eleven contacts at once on a 13" MacBook Pro. It's nothing to do with what I'm doing at the same time, or multitasking, it just doesn't do the job efficiently. It's bloated.

Did you get the Windows design team in to mess this up for you? People who don't understand the concept of application designed with multiple windows? Or, more likely, did an executive or group of executives with no idea about interface design make this their pet project and prevent the design team from doing their job properly?

malohkan commented Tuesday, Apr 12

Since the Skype feedback cancellation isn't very good, when I have a skype call for business and 2 people on the call of 6 people are in the same room, everyone has to mute unless they're speaking. Since people forget, it was always so convenient to have the tiny list of mic levels in the top right corner of my screen always floating on top. I could easily say "Hey Bob, mute please" because I could clearly see they were echoing. Now I have to have the huge bloated ugly terrible box that covers 2/3 of my screen and stare closely to see if I can notice that one person's subtle glow is bigger than another person's subtle glow and ask that person to mute. I've lost functionality. It's harder to do what I used to be able to do so quickly and easily. What target audience was made happier by this? Was this change a benefit to anyone at all? It's certainly problematic for me. I'm bothered every day by the lack of this feature.

joeeeel_dinasour commented Tuesday, Apr 12

Dear Rick,
First of all, thank you for interacting with us this way and for making an update on this issue.

I don't have much to add, most of the things I have an issue with have been already said; however, I don't agree or support the concept of the primary, combined window. This might work and might be liked by Windows users, but Mac users are used to something else. A Mac-like application is not an all-in-one window or UI, take for example an app made by Apple: Pages. A real Mac-like application has multiple windows, that only appear when you need them and you close when you don't need them anymore.

This is sort of a philosophy for many Mac applications and for Apple too, things should only be there if they have an use, a light should only be there if it's indicating something, not because it looks pretty, etc. Skype 5.X does not follow these basic ideas, it has features that are not really useful. Many people, myself included, are not talking about multi-tasking here, we really mean that the UI is simply ugly, bloated.

The new UI wouldn't receive all this criticism if at least we could choose which UI we want, without having to revert back to 2.8.

Many of us believe that having an independent contact list and a messages window with detachable tabs works better than a bloated window full of information that it's not needed all the time.

aralinzg commented Wednesday, Apr 13

As many others, I hate the 5.0 design with passion. I honestly tried to use it and make it work for few months, but it got to point where I considered not using skype anymore and for last month I did not even run the application 100% of time as I used to. My negative attitude to using it make me not want to even log in to your service.

What is wrong?
1) I cannot just have a small list in corner to quickly at glance see who of my friends is online.
2) I cannot video call and post links and comments and cut & paste stuff for people I talk with at the same time.
3) I cannot chat with multiple friends at the same time just reading what one is writting while I type message for the other one. I cannot keep chatting with my friends while on video call.
4) I keep contact lists for all IM services on separate monitor to the side, I don't want to turn my head away from the camera when video calling someone and I don't want to move the Skype windows around every time someone calls me. I especially hate you for this one.
5) I hate you every time you force me to grab my mouse in app that I interface with primarilly with my keyboard.
6) I used to switch between chats of friends with Mac window switching through keyboard shortcuts.

Quality of calls
1) My calls sound worse with 5.x
2) My microphone settings break often in 5.x and it often disconnects my USB microphone even though it is properly configured
3) I often have problem to make calls to landline with 5.x that don't exist with 2.8
4) My dial pad disconnects in middle of phone call and I cannot dial options (like unmute) during conference calls. Again just in 5.x

Wish List (features not in 2.8 or 5.x)
1) Smart contact groups - let me create dynamic smart groups of contacts (everyone from US, everyone not in group, everyone with email @skype.com, ...)
2) I have a lot of skype contacts for people who I only care about on weekends or when I do certain activity or at work, but not otherwise. Not everyone is my friend and my coworkers don't need to see me online on weekends and my parents should not see me available while at work.
a) Let me turn off tracking online presence or even seeing those contacts from certain group.
b) Let me block them from contacting me during certain times or allow me to change my presence for this specific group.

I will stay with 2.8 until you address the above issues, but not forever, your inability to address these issues creates a great opportunity for your competition.

menteinfinita commented Wednesday, Apr 13

To make it more simple:
I think you (Skype Team) should have learned one thing:
Mac users are not Windows users.

Windows users willingly adopted that fullscreen app you released in v4.
At least I don't remember such a huge negative feedback.
Maybe because in v4@Win you had the option to switch to classic mode?
Or maybe because Win users are actually used to use fullscreen apps?
Dono.

On Mac, sticking with that unusable almost fullscreen design without the optional classic mode is surely the wrong choice.
Actually, on Mac, it should be the classic mode as default and optional (making it hard to find would be a good choice ) that huge ugly unusable thing (I apologize - CNR).

And guys, that thing is not easier to use for anyone. Neither was v4 for Windows. Neither does having it all in one place nor does wasting so much space necessarily make an app easier to deal with or to look more structured. Who told you that? M$? *eg*

I feel sorry for you guys though, most of all for the designer(s). So many people picking on you & your work... on the other hand you seem still to think this is the right way (at least this blogpost sounds a little like that). Guys, it's not. Why don't you just say "OK, sorry dear customers, Skype v5 for Mac is not as awesome as we initially thought, we'll make you happy with the next version" instead of pointing out the goodies (for me they are not) of v5?

I don't know if I mentioned this before in one of my prior posts, but I think it's only the lack of alternatives who let most (all I know) mac users downgrade to 2.8 instead to switch to another service. But I'm pretty sure, if you stay on this road, another provider will show up soon. Matter of time. But for now, your fate still rests with you. Don't lose it.

Written from my Mac with Skype 2.8 installed and, for the first time in 8 years, without any desires to even look at any Skype upgrade until next major version.

jmcward commented Thursday, Apr 14

Hi Skype,

If the point was to take a reasonable interface (v2.8) that did the job well, to a massive waste of space and something you constantly need to hide to get it out of your way, then this new version is a success.

Great pieces of software are functional, well thought out and stay out of your way. The only part IMHO
you have managed is it is functional. The interface is way off and is a pain to use and it just takes
up a lot amount of space.

Well it may be all well and good to try to account for everyones tastes, cultures, experience levels
and so on, most of the time it just becomes a big compromise. Using the analogy of a car, you don't design a bus to go to the Indy 500. This is what Skype feels like to me a bus. Version 2.8 was more like an Indy car, clean and fast and out of my way.

Please fix this - I'm going back to the old version. I don't have the patience for the requirement of
hiding and showing the controls all day long!

Again - Please Fix ! TX

soulatrium commented Thursday, Apr 14

To me it really is about screen real estate. Regardless of the functionality the current design may have, the minimum size for the main window in v5 for Mac takes up way too much real estate when all I want to see is which of my contacts are online. At least let me reduce the size of the interface elements so I can get back to the same window size as I've been using the last couple of years in Skype for Mac.

nicolas_baumueller commented Thursday, Apr 14

Hello Skype!

When the first 5.0 beta came out I was so disappointed about the new UI. Directly went back to 2.8. Since then I've been following the discussion on this blog and I was glad to see so many other users articulating what I was feeling.

Until now I didn't make my voice heard, because I thought these voices were loud enough. How can you not hear us? There are more people out there like me who didn't post on this blog, but who would agree to all the complaints put forward.

Now you give us this marketing talk about who your users are, about majorities and segments and about Chinese grandmothers. Are you serious? Chinese grandmothers with Macs? Is that the 5.0 target audience?

Listen to us!

Do I really need to repeat this?

1. It's too big.

2. Give us an optional view mode with separate windows for contacts, video and chat.

tonyasouther commented Thursday, Apr 14

What you seem to fail to understand is that screen real estate is the single most expensive resource you can consume. Don't believe me? Go look at what it costs to get a bigger monitor.

No, it's not all about multitasking. Wasting screen real estate makes everything harder. Nobody uses a computer for just one thing any more, and those of us who need to be on Skype while we're dong something else may well not be multitasking at all.

You appear to suffer from the same problem as Linden Lab did when they developed their new and improved client for Second Life: they asked a professional design consultant what they should do, instead of asking people who actually use the service. The result was an unusable mess that, among other things, ignored how real people actually got things done in Second Life. I'm one of the lead developers of a third-party client that aims to make things usable again. The irony of the group doing this on Skype, which suffers from the same disease, is palpable.

I'm going back to 2.8, and staying there. As for getting money out of me for anything: forget it until you start listening to users and seeing how they use the service, in stead of telling us how we should be using it.

chaos_blazer commented Thursday, Apr 14

@peterparkes, about capturing the frustrations: no, you've failed.

let me talk about user experience in a 13,3 inch macbook:

I've worked with many voip and IM clients, not only with a Mac but also with windows, and I've learned some things:

1) a contact visualizer window is not the same as a main window with a visible contact list,

2) when the main window and the call/im windows are fused, no work can be done, since each user wants to do something with the contact list (like inviting someone to the chat/call, opening a new chat/call window, quick switching between chats/calls by just sitching the window or clicking a nicely located tab),

3) sending files is only optimal if you can drag'n drop them (skype 2.8 lets you do this),

4) one window with it's specific function helps users to be more selective with (in other words: PRIORITIZE!) the tasks to be done.

Don't you think having a big window with all the app inside will help new users: we live in a modular era for desktop/notebook apps, even in Photoshop (for Mac, at least) each toolbar is independent and can be feely moved/relocated/hidden at the user's contempt (both for newbies and wizards), why should my dear Skype lose this characteristic?

By having my main window at the left corner on the bottom (with Adium on the top-left corner) i have two compact contactlists, and I can work with their two chat windows and deal with a videcall with ease, specially when I need to swap between them and other apps a lot (and I surely do it, since not all my college colleagues use Skype and I need to work with them).

I'm not telling you to rethink the user interface, or create a contest to better up the monster condensed single futuristic window, WE WANT YOU TO KEEP EVERYTHING AT IT'S PLACE! Yes, one function per window. Nobody complained about the 2.8's design, and more, we have made you put it back online so people can "downgrade" to it.

You need only to work with the 2.8's interface. You can tweak it, as long as it doesn't take more space than needed.

You should benefit of your own work: you have a completely resizeable call window, that works perfectly with group audio calls and single video calls, so why don't you simply make it hold the group video calls as well? A SIMPLE SEPARATE WINDO THAT CAN GO FULLSCREEN AND STILL LET YOU WORK WITH A CHAT WINDOW OVER IT (I do with with my girlfriend all the time: her video displayed at my screen in fullscreen mode and I can still summon, when needed, the chat window to send her text/files or the main window so I can text someone without losing focus on the video).

I hope I haven't been too much of an agressor, but you've striken me first!

So, how about my design ideas? I am sure that most of the users will approve of it. Even better: let us choose between the "almighty 5.X" interface or the "optimized for excellence at actually working 2.8" interface at the preferences (any user knows who to cmd+comma...)

ssslash commented Friday, Apr 15

after downgrading (a second time) to 2.8 i just can say wow. 2.8 is such a nice piece of software. everything i need in this little of space. skype team - you are awesome. after this 5x nightmare i can see who is online, i can chat in as many windows as i want. no scrolling, no anything - just a useful product. thank you for getting this huge step forward with 2.8. a downgraded happy-again skype user.

balupton commented Friday, Apr 15

Man.... This is the first time I've ever heard of anyone hating the Skype 5 interface. Every single person that I know of, loves it. We all rejoiced with the upgrade. Having one window and the simplified UI is just soo much easier and less confusing. I hated the Skype 2 interface of having a window for flipping everything, I already have 10-30 windows open, I don't need more. I just want to click skype, and have the one window open, not have to keep trying to find the right window. Skype 5 rocks. Don't change it.

venatir commented Friday, Apr 15

I read a message higher in this list and I totally support it. It goes like this:
Create skype 2.9 to add the new feature, but keep the 2.8 interface. If skype does this, it proves that it has the courage to admit its own mistakes. Why try to make a mac application look like the windows one in the first place... look what happened. when all chat programs are having a standard paradigm with the user list on one side and a some chat windows separate, and this works ... why try to change it ?! For the sake of being "inovative" ? this sometimes ... fail as you can see. Now admit it and go back to the initial version and add the features in there.

denis.kugappi commented Friday, Apr 15

Hello,

Thank you first of all for taking the time to listen to the Skype Mac community. To sum up some points already mentioned, I think there is a general concensus about what would make Skype better:

Make Skype small again, and give me back my screen space. The general idea here is that I want to use skype as a tool along side other windows, but at this point it's too "fat", even on a 17 inch macbook pro, and kind of goes against the "multi-tasking" aspect.

1) Eliminate all the white space. It is difficult to use an interface where your eye consistently travels from one element to another, and it eats up a big portion of my screen.
2) The contact list and the "history" bar along the left are extremely unintuitive. I am never sure where I should click to initiate a chat. The way skype had it before was genuinely much more intuitive.
3) Eliminate the repetition, the contact list displays the same buttons for each user you can click on - why? The "add" button appears twice, once in the main bar, and once right below as 'add contact'.
4) The buttons are grouped oddly: Why are there separate buttons that give me some menu options, and other buttons that give me other menu options (they aren't grouped logically so why have them at all?) - again, wasting screen real estate.

I am also pretty sure that very few people are fond of the "Avatar view" cover-flow view. It doesn't give any visibility into all your contacts, (why would I ever click 20 times, rather than just see a clear concise list I can instantly access) and again wastes space.

Unfortunately right now it's heavy, wasteful of space, and illogically grouped functions make it hard to use.

In our company of 50 people we all tried skype 5, and reverted back to 2.8.

Thank you for your continued support, and we, the community, hope you continue to improve Skype's UI to be LIGHT, USEFUL, and COMPREHENSIVE.

Cheers

hendriktje42 commented Saturday, Apr 16

When I downloaded 2.8 the Contacts automatically found my email address book and copied it. I have just downloaded 5X on another laptop and it has not found my email address book and only offers me a way to enter phone numbers in the new contact list. What, if anything, have I done wrong?

canoeberry commented Saturday, Apr 16

It's amazing that skype is interacting with us like this, amazing in a good way. Companies like Apple never ever respond, which is frustrating even for fanboys like myself.

The main UI thing is that it needs to be possible to have multiple chats in separate windows at once, along with a video or screen sharing. I do not want to have to move the mouse to click anything to see what I am missing. And the main thing that goes a long with that is I want to be able to make those individual windows as small as I would like (within reason) so that I can see as much as possible at one time.

So along with that is, The text input area is 4 lines tall and cannot be made smaller. It should be possible to make it 1 line tall if I want.

There are other things like, Why show a side drawer when there's only one other person in the chat? One reason is so you can tell somebody is typing, but really there should be some indication of that some place other than the drawer.

Another thing which seems wasteful and annoying is, When I connect back later, I receive all the messages I missed over night. That can be several hundred or more messages, which can be sort of painful. Even worse, skype on my iPhone insists on loading all those messages as well, over the slow 3G network. That needs to be smarter.

Anyway, glad you're taking the complaints seriously. If 2.8 got deleted I would have been forced to delete the app and find an alternative... but I don't know any alternatives.

zuriel.andrusyshyn commented Monday, Apr 18

Are you making it so the "Contacts Monitor" is able to NOT ALWAYS be on top??

Am I the only one who read the whole article and felt like that question wasn't answered? Ok great.. you want to keep your GIANT interface.. fine.. i have a big monitor... but I WANT to use the contacts monitor when other apps are running and I don't want or need the contact monitor ON TOP of xcode or any other app that im using in the forground.. I also don't want to hit a keystroke to show and hide it just to see who is online.. I like to click my icon on the dock or hit alt + tab and goto skype.. I just want the option of it not being on top.. its the closest thing to a skype 2.8 layout you have minus being designed in a HUD window, which i like.